trep

I think I'm losing my initial luke warm interest.

torbek

Sorry mate.

You're wrong.

Not in the model I'm suggesting.

Besides, Thailand already has numerous associations of various forms already...
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Not sure how to do that. There are literally thousands. And if you forward the information to the administrators, it may never get passed on.


I suspect if it were to work, there is an element of snow-balling about it.

Most members would need to see something begun before they'd bother joining...even if you weren't asking an initial membership fee.

A meeting isn't a bad way to go, but sort of limits attendance to whoever lives where the meeting is held.


I kind of figure you need a solid 20 - 30 starters. They make a couple of representations to the MoE and some other relevant groups informing them of their intentions and hopefully garnering some support. Then they communicate the outcomes and, hopefully having a little more direction by that time, seek to sign up members.


Thing here is, most associations take years, even decades, to get up and running, and all ran through various manifestations, coups, splits, splinters, factions, etc. at some time in their lives.

To expect a perfectly running association from the outset just wont happen.

Maybe that is why it resides in the "too hard" basket.
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It might end up with enough legitimate power to generally protect interests...but that is really a year or so away at least. The power has to be recognised and accepted by those to who it is being "flexed".

eg. a standard English language contract could be drafted...the numbers for salary etc. would remain flexible but things like terms of renewal, dismissal, etc. could be fixed. A guy goes for an interview and is presented a piece of crap and suggests "I'd like to use the Teachers' Assiciation contract thanks..."

Even that is small win...but will take time.

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Most people are other people. Their thoughts are someone else's opinions, their lives a mimicry, their passions a quotation.

trep

I'm not losing interest, really. I think most teachers will be very enthusiastic once it gets past idle talk stage. It's easy to bounce off ideas on a discussion board, it's even absolutely necessary in planning stages, but there's a long long way before making it into reality. You'll need a strong back up from Thai establishment. Do you know anyone up in the Min Ed who could be sympathetic?

That's how I see it at the moment - Min Ed backed way to put schools in line.

On the other hand I like the romantic notion of Natural Born Killers inspired squad enforcing the law. Are you sure guns cannot be issued to EFL police?

torbek

Obviously I wouldn't start it without some involvement. I'm willing to put in a limited amount of work and resouces if some others are...

But I am based outside Bangkok so would never consider a major role. Maybe the website - without banner advertising or a revenue model!

To toss up some names (NOT an exhaustive list nor a great deal of thought gone into it!), I think any of the following would be good candidates...

Haltest, Soijetcornergirl, Mad Dod, Trep, Defender, Johnny Danger (yes!), Wat Dog, Whitey, Keeshou, Qwerty2, Laoshi, Dunce Cap, Loner, 8Ball, Matthew, Bet, paully, El Tel, Classic-Chassis, Panhunger, Cyrille, Nemo, Umbuku, laowai, Kempos, Reg Young, Rumploe, Keegan, robitusson, Mister Stretch, banned, Russell Simpson, jaidee, Covertjai, Asper, Traveller2, mig, zehner,


…in other words anyone with at least an ounce of passion about things to do with teaching…regardless if you might view that passion as positive or negative. Diversity adds credibility as it removes the accusation of the association representing a select group or perspective only.
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No, I don't.

Another reason why I wouldn't suitable for any more than dog work in the association.

Yes I agree...which is why it was one of the first steps in the process I raised. Without at least a begrudging acceptance of the idea of an association by the MoE - which will have to sold via the benefits it presents to the MoE as well as teachers - the you have nothing.

For example, we agree to draft of Code of Conduct...that always seems to give governments departments everyone some comfort...self regulation.

But we need to be able to pitch to them something like "Preliminary investigations show we can sign up X number in the first year"...or something like that.

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Most people are other people. Their thoughts are someone else's opinions, their lives a mimicry, their passions a quotation.

Unwell

not true mate. there's a good few.

they have power too. was the "electricity workers' union" that played a very large part in the campaign to resist privatising egat. were succesful too, for now.

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"...ever wonder why they kill the weak ones, baby?"

Nickyboy

I'm serious about teaching, it's just that the majority of Thais aren't serious about learning.

By the way, laoshi lives in England and 8ball can't write properly....

ScorpioPower

torbek; all the best with your 'venture'.

Food for thought, such an association could be administered across something like ajarnforum.net

Have a word with the guys in charge [Bangkok Phil and LDMA I think] and see what ideas they come back with.

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This'll be 20 years old come this October and it still sounds brilliant...
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Unwell

my sentiments precisely. that's why i'm going back to the u.k. to teach. this place is good for a larf. nothing more.

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"...ever wonder why they kill the weak ones, baby?"

torbek

The point was (and it was that thread about 'Bangkok fighting back' that got me thinking) while ajarnforum.net and ajarn.com has the capacity to undertake some of the functions of an association, the reality is they are a commercial venture that derives income from other stakeholders in the industry who may not have the same interest at heart as a group of teachers.

Hence why Bangkok Phil was not menioned in my list despite the fact he would have excellent contacts already.

He may well be willing to offer assistance - I haven't asked - but if he were an office holder in the association, accusations of conflicting interest would no doubt be leveled.

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Most people are other people. Their thoughts are someone else's opinions, their lives a mimicry, their passions a quotation.

Cyrille

I've been through it so many times before. A meeting of 100 teachers will mean 1,000 questions and 1,000,000 approaches advocated.

With not one person genuinely putting their trust in anyone else to prioritise. We're a disparate, grouchy bunch - just look at these pages for ten minutes!

Would YOU want to spend wearying hours explaining what seems to be the patently obvious to someone whose only genuine conviction is the type you have to do time for?
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[quote=torbek]Yes, I know it will take a bit of work and face a few obstacles, so if you do want to throw up negatives - do us a favour and offer suggestions to deal with the negatives as well. [quote]

I'll respond as I like, thanks.

torbek

Well, I did say "...do us a favour...", a clear indication that it was a request, not a demand...





But I suspect everything else you say is near enough to 100% correct anyway. Just sticking my toe in the water.

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Most people are other people. Their thoughts are someone else's opinions, their lives a mimicry, their passions a quotation.

Covertjay

A professional association, as opposed to a union, couldn't hurt.

Thai teachers have one.

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"Kiwis that move to Australia raise the I.Q of both countries" David Lange.

Cyrille

Fair enough - but what I wonder is would you really want to represent TEFLers in any sense?
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There are all sorts of reasons why I wouldn't. A major one is that I've never at any point been able to say with any degree of certainty that I'd be in Thailand in 12 months time.

Then there's the dimwits you'd actually have to listen to droning on endlessly.
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Thai teachers have common ground - common priorities - common goals. It's a whole different ball game.

soijetcornergirl