9/11 Redux - Page 3 - Ajarn Forum

Big Bill · 4th March 2008, 23:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by zazel

Blackhawk Congo Lisa.

Yes!!

keeshou · 5th March 2008, 05:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by Big Bill

Like Kosovo.

You lost me here.

robitusson · 5th March 2008, 19:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by esoteric1

Just as bad don't you think?

Allowing the attack to hqappen through negligence and incompetence as bad as the US government attacking and killing thousands of its own citizens? No, it's not just as bad at all.

esoteric1 · 5th March 2008, 19:14

Big Bill mentioned Kosovo

Quote:

Originally Posted by keeshou

You lost me here.

so what are you saying keeshou, since someone you liked was President then, that war was ok?

That war was justified by as many lies as the one in Iraq...IMHO.

-----

Quote:

Originally Posted by robitusson

Allowing the attack to hqappen through negligence and incompetence as bad as the US government attacking and killing thousands of its own citizens? No, it's not just as bad at all.

I guess the difference here is that you think they're not capable of doing that, and I believe they are, or least allowing it to happen on purpose.....someone's already mentioned the Northwoods documents.

Northwoods Documents

robitusson · 5th March 2008, 19:36

I think they do what's in their interest and what's in the interest of who they represent. Blowing up the Twin Towers on national tv, then blaming it on those who they already have long-standing grievances with, then leaving loose ends around for amateurs to fantastically expose on the internet is not in their interest.

Seeking huge, meaningful reasons to match a huge, meaningful event is in the interest of the c.t. supporters.

esoteric1 · 5th March 2008, 19:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by robitusson

what's in the interest of who they represent.

I no longer think they represent the interests of the common American citizens.

robitusson · 5th March 2008, 19:45

Oh Christ no!! Big business, Israel, etc. that's what I mean by who they represent.

esoteric1 · 5th March 2008, 19:50

^you do realize that the destruction of the WTC(aging buildings with a high vacancy rate) was advantageous(in a monetary business sense) to some of those interests, right?

not to mention the insurance payout.

Intrepid · 5th March 2008, 19:59

The collaborators are just as guilty as the one that sticks the knife in.

zazel · 5th March 2008, 20:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by esoteric1

not to mention the insurance payout.

Not to mention the short-selling of United and American Airlines stocks.

esoteric1 · 5th March 2008, 20:11

^ it's claimed that payout was never collected...think that's true?

keeshou · 5th March 2008, 20:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by esoteric1

so what are you saying keeshou, since someone you liked was President then, that war was ok? That war was justified by as many lies as the one in Iraq...IMHO.

Kosovo wasn't even a country until a couple of days ago, so I don't see how you can equate the two, but the problems in what was formally Yugoslavia and is now about 8 countries weren't the pipedream of some President and the situation was handled without having to invade Croatia or placing sanctions on the people or lasting 18 years (which is what the situation in Iraq has if you count back to when G.H.W. Bush first went after Iraq).

I see the separating of Kosovo from Serbia as at least not causing any new violence (have you heard of any new mass killings within the last 8 years), I'd equate the action with the separating of the Kurdish area of Iraq, if it had ever happened. As much as I dislike G.W. Bush, I've never harped on him for attacking Afghanistan.

So, you can attribute it to your notion that I've been blinded to Clinton's misdeeds by some kind of loyalty to him, but I think it's not the same kettle of fish at all.

esoteric1 · 5th March 2008, 20:23

Quote:

Originally Posted by keeshou

Kosovo wasn't even a country until a couple of days ago

But it was called the Kosovo War at the time, as for the aftermath:

Quote:

Aftermath

Within three weeks, over 500,000 Albanian refugees had returned home. By November 1999, according to the UN High Commissioner for Refugees, 808,913 out of 848,100 had returned.

However, an estimated 200,000 Serbs fled Kosovo.[52] Gypsies were also driven out after being harassed by Albanians. Since June 12, 1999, as many as 1,000 Serbs and Roma have been murdered or have gone missing as a result of KLA elements and possibly criminal gangs or vengeful individuals.[53][35] The Yugoslav Red Cross had also registered 247,391 mostly Serbian refugees by November. The new exodus was a severe embarrassment to NATO, which had established a peacekeeping force of 45,000 under the auspices of the United Nations Mission In Kosovo (UNMIK).

Returning IDPs from the Republic of Macedonia were kept in a lead polluted refugee camp set up by KFOR / UNMIK in North Mitrovica. The charity, ran by Paul Polansky, claims 27 died from lead poisoning, denied by UNMIK who recognise only one death.

According to Amnesty International, the presence of peacekeepers in Kosovo led to an increase in the trafficking of women for sexual exploitation.[54][55][56]

Kosovo War - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

the justifications for it are still questionable in my mind.

Boonmee · 5th March 2008, 21:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by esoteric1

the justifications for it are still questionable in my mind.

Quote:

Thanks to peacekeeping, the UN was not left without meaning

- Francois Debrix

Quote:

[peacekeeping] can rightly be called the invention of the UN

-Boutros Boutros-Ghali

These two quotes suggest that peacekeeping operations are frequently as much in the interest of the peacekeepers, as they are in the interest of the host state.
Peacekeeping operations also offer the opportunity for certain militaries to keep their training and professionalism up-to-date. For the individual soldier as well as for the government which sends him, the financial rewards of peacekeeping (eg under the UN banner) can also make it very worthwhile.

Intrepid · 5th March 2008, 22:12

Canadian Prime Minister Pearson is considered the father of modern peacekeeping. Won a Nobel Peace Prize.

Proud Canuck here