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Thread: Why Zionism-Nazism Comparisons are Legitimate

  1. #91
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    Re: Why Zionism-Nazism Comparisons are Legitimate

    interesting and, it's certainly true that Zionists dont speak for all Jews.

    New poll reveals how unrepresentative neocon Jewish groups are - Glenn Greenwald - Salon.com

    A new survey of American Jewish opinion, released by the American Jewish Committee, demonstrates several important propositions: (1) right-wing neocons (the Bill Kristol/Commentary/ AIPAC/Marty Peretz faction) who relentlessly claim to speak for Israel and for Jews generally hold views that are shared only by a small minority of American Jews; (2) viewpoints that are routinely demonized as reflective of animus towards Israel or even anti-Semitism are ones that are held by large majorities of American Jews; and (3) most American Jews oppose U.S. military action in the Middle East -- including both in Iraq and against Iran.
    It is beyond dispute that American Jews overwhelmingly oppose core neoconservative foreign policy principles. Hence, in large numbers, they disapprove of the way the U.S. is handling its "campaign against terrorism" (59-31); overwhelmingly believe the U.S. should have stayed out of Iraq (67-27); believe that things are going "somewhat badly" or "very badly" in Iraq (76-23); and believe that the "surge" has either made things worse or has had no impact (68-30).
    </H2>

  2. #92
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    Re: Why Zionism-Nazism Comparisons are Legitimate

    Local Austin non-violent Palestinian activist Riad Hamad was found in the river, hands and legs bound with a blind-fold.

    And the police say suicide?

    Right, hands and legs bound, tape over his eyes. He managed all this, then hopped to the lake and squirmed along until he got in deep enough to drown.

    This kind of stuff doesn't even make it into movies because it wouldn't be believable, yet the media put it out and expect us to buy into it.

    Remember the Roberto Calvi case? Where the police, years later, finally managed to work out that it would have been impossible for Calvi to have killed himself in the position in which his body was found.

    Here's what the Zionist Frontpage Mag had to say about Hamad:

    Recruiting for Jihad

    The Palestinian Children’s Welfare Fund (PCWF) is one of a multitude of Islamic children’s charities whose stated goal is “to improve the living standards of the children of Palestine.” One of the ways the PCWF has demonstrated this was to conduct a drawing contest in October of 2002, whereby children won money for drawing gruesome pictures depicting anti-Semitic and violent images.

    The PCWF is headed by Riad Hamad. Hamad's resume includes being fired from Austin Community College for allegedly "making racist slurs and sexist jokes in the classroom." He doesn't agree, though; he says he was fired for "making statements against the U.S. government." Hamad is currently an instructor at a different school, in his words, "till I get fired again."

    The FBI has on a number of occasions conducted surveillance on Riad Hamad.

    His neighbors have been interviewed, his co-workers have been questioned, and packages he has sent have been opened - with good reason, it would appear.

    Riad Hamad spelled out his anti-Semitic agenda during a response to an online article. According to his version of history, "Britain allowed several hundreds of thousands of illegal immigrants to land in Palestine despite the opposition of the original inhabitants.
    Anti-Semitic agenda?

    Oh, OK, got it! The ultimate anti-Semitic act - to feed a starving Palestinian child, so allowing that child to live and grow up, adding to the "demographic problem" facing Zionists in the Middle East.

    Hamad had described a campaign of government harassment against his charitable work.
    I've never seen a president - I don't care who he is - stand up to them (the Israelis). It just boggles your mind. They always get what they want ... If the American people understood what grip those people have on our government, they would rise up in arms.

    Admiral Thomas H. Moorer, Former Chief of Naval Operations, and Chairman, Joint Chiefs of Staff, quoted in Andrew Hurley's book, One Nation Under Israel

  3. #93
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    Re: Why Zionism-Nazism Comparisons are Legitimate

    interesting!

    BBC - Religion & Ethics - British Jews and the Dream of Zion

    British Jews and the Dream of Zion

    Jonathan Freedland

    Jonathan Freedland explores the complex relationship between British Jews and the Jewish homeland in a programme recorded to mark the 60th anniversary of the creation of the state of Israel.

    Monday 28 April and Monday 5 May, 20:02, BBC Radio 4

    For many Jews, Israel is like your family: it deserves your loyalty, you could never disown it and when others attack you leap to its defence.

    Jews who criticise Israel are sometimes condemned as 'self-loathing' by members of their own community. Devout Jews pray daily for Israel - or Zion as it's known in the ancient texts. Israel and Zionism are sensitive subjects, regarded as going to the heart of what it means to be Jewish.

    Yet the relationship between British Jews and the state of Israel is a new one, not yet 60 years old. To what extent does the modern state represent the 'promised land' of scripture?

    In these two programmes, journalist Jonathan Freedland explores how British Jewish attitudes to the idea of a Jewish homeland - and to the reality - have evolved, examining the perspectives of both secular and religious Jews and exploring Zionism's dual role as a religious and political movement.

    In the first programme, we hear from Jewish historian Colin Schindler as well as figures caught up in the history of Zionism - including Tony Benn (a former Zionist) and Dame Simone Prendergast (of the Marks and Spencer dynasty).

  4. #94
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    Re: Why Zionism-Nazism Comparisons are Legitimate

    I guess I will have to breath some life in this thread tomorrow.... I am pooped.

    Xtra

  5. #95
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    Re: Why Zionism-Nazism Comparisons are Legitimate

    BBC NEWS | Middle East | Israel warns of invasion of Gaza

    Israeli minister threatens Palestinians with a "holocaust".

    Eliyahu advocates carpet bombing Gaza | Jerusalem Post

    A chief rabbi advocates carpet bombing Gaza


    Eliyahu ruled that there was absolutely no moral prohibition against the indiscriminate killing of civilians during a potential massive military offensive on Gaza aimed at stopping the rocket launchings.

    Shame the seriousness of stuff like this is taken away when people use it for anti-Semitic puposes.

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  6. #96
    Regular User Xtrafresh has a reputation beyond repute Xtrafresh has a reputation beyond repute Xtrafresh has a reputation beyond repute Xtrafresh has a reputation beyond repute Xtrafresh has a reputation beyond repute Xtrafresh has a reputation beyond repute Xtrafresh has a reputation beyond repute Xtrafresh has a reputation beyond repute Xtrafresh has a reputation beyond repute Xtrafresh has a reputation beyond repute Xtrafresh has a reputation beyond repute
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    Re: Why Zionism-Nazism Comparisons are Legitimate

    Quote Originally Posted by robitusson View Post
    BBC NEWS | Middle East | Israel warns of invasion of Gaza

    Israeli minister threatens Palestinians with a "holocaust".

    Eliyahu advocates carpet bombing Gaza | Jerusalem Post

    A chief rabbi advocates carpet bombing Gaza

    Do you know Hebriew robitusson?Matan Vilnai used the word "Shoah" which means disaster. The phrase that he used was "yamitu al atsmam shoah gdolah yoter." Yamitu Shoah means to bring about a disaster. If you can read Hebrew then I would suggest that you visit these two sites:

    äçééí áćéôěĺ÷ - ôéĺ ôéĺ ŕúä îú

    äćëĺú ěäĺřĺú - äćëĺú ěéěăĺú

    The first site discusses whether or not child subsidies will cause a "shoah" and the second site discusses whether or not computers will cause a "shoah



    The proper Hebrew word to describe holocaust is
    Hashoah


    Now to the second article: I agree with the Rabbi. Israel has a long and proud tradition of trying to protect the innocent Arabs living in Gaza and the West Bank. It grieves us to no end when innocent people are killed. The cowardly terrorists have used human shields (women, children and babies) to thwart attacks. This is against the Geneva Convention and a war crime in on itself. For decades Israel have restrained the hand of justice to protect them but the patience of many in Israel is waning. Why, they argue, are the terrorists allowed to freely target our children and get away by hiding behind theirs? The Rabbi has made many strong points (and I wish that more people could understand Hebrew on these forums) in his sermon.

    Xtra
    Last edited by Xtrafresh; 2nd May 2008 at 20:22.

  7. #97
    Senior Member robitusson has a reputation beyond repute robitusson has a reputation beyond repute robitusson has a reputation beyond repute robitusson has a reputation beyond repute robitusson has a reputation beyond repute robitusson has a reputation beyond repute robitusson has a reputation beyond repute robitusson has a reputation beyond repute robitusson has a reputation beyond repute robitusson has a reputation beyond repute robitusson has a reputation beyond repute robitusson's Avatar
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    Re: Why Zionism-Nazism Comparisons are Legitimate

    Quote Originally Posted by Xtrafresh View Post
    Do you know Hebriew robitusson?Matan Vilnai used the word "Shoah" which means disaster. The phrase that he used was "yamitu al atsmam shoah gdolah yoter." Yamitu Shoah means to bring about a disaster.
    Sounds a bit like Larry Craig and his "wide stance" excuse.

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  8. #98
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    Re: Why Zionism-Nazism Comparisons are Legitimate

    The loathsome smearing of Israel's critics

    8 May 2008

    In the US and Britain, there is a campaign to smear anybody who tries to describe the plight of the Palestinian people. It is an attempt to intimidate and silence – and to a large degree, it works. There is nobody these self-appointed spokesmen for Israel will not attack as anti-Jewish: liberal Jews, rabbis, even Holocaust survivors.

    My own case isn't especially important, but it illustrates how the wider process of intimidation works. I have worked undercover at both the Finsbury Park mosque and among neo-Nazi Holocaust deniers to expose the Jew-hatred there; when I went on the Islam Channel to challenge the anti-Semitism of Islamists, I received a rash of death threats calling me "a Jew-lover", "a Zionist-homo pig" and more.

    Ah, but wait. I have also reported from Gaza and the West Bank. Last week, I wrote an article that described how untreated sewage was being pumped from illegal Israeli settlements on to Palestinian land, contaminating their reservoirs. This isn't controversial. It has been documented by Friends of the Earth, and I have seen it with my own eyes.

    The response? There was little attempt to dispute the facts I offered. Instead, some of the most high profile "pro-Israel" writers and media monitoring groups – including Honest Reporting and Camera – said I an anti-Jewish bigot akin to Joseph Goebbels and Mahmoud Ahmadinejadh, while Melanie Phillips even linked the stabbing of two Jewish people in North London to articles like mine. Vast numbers of e-mails came flooding in calling for me to be sacked.

    Any attempt to describe accurately the situation for Palestinians is met like this. If you recount the pumping of sewage onto Palestinian land, "Honest Reporting" claims you are reviving the anti-Semitic myth of Jews "poisoning the wells." If you interview a woman whose baby died in 2002 because she was detained – in labour – by Israeli soldiers at a checkpoint within the West Bank, "Honest Reporting" will say you didn't explain "the real cause": the election of Hamas in, um, 2006. And on, and on.

    The former editor of Israel's leading newspaper, Ha'aretz, David Landau, calls the behaviour of these groups "nascent McCarthyism". Those responsible hold extreme positions of their own that place them way to the right of most Israelis. Alan Dershowitz and Melanie Phillips are two of the most prominent figures sent in to attack anyone who disagrees with the Israeli right. Dershowitz is a lawyer, Harvard professor and author of The Case For Israel. He sees ethnic cleansing as a trifling matter, writing: "Political solutions often require the movement of people, and such movement is not always voluntary ... It is a fifth-rate issue analogous in many respects to some massive urban renewal." If a prominent American figure takes a position on Israel to the left of this, Dershowitz often takes to the airwaves to call them anti-Semites and bigots.


    ...

    I've never seen a president - I don't care who he is - stand up to them (the Israelis). It just boggles your mind. They always get what they want ... If the American people understood what grip those people have on our government, they would rise up in arms.

    Admiral Thomas H. Moorer, Former Chief of Naval Operations, and Chairman, Joint Chiefs of Staff, quoted in Andrew Hurley's book, One Nation Under Israel

  9. #99
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    Re: Why Zionism-Nazism Comparisons are Legitimate


  10. #100
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    Decided to put this here, rather than start a new thread. An Israel is making this film. Attempts to censor it. The common names of Foxman of the ADL and some new names as well.

    The Film Zionists Are Trying To Crush

    Israeli director Yoav Shamir embarks on a provocative – and at times irreverent – quest to answer the question, “What is anti-Semitism today?” Does it remain a dangerous and immediate threat? Or is it a scare tactic used by right-wing Zionists to discredit their critics? Speaking with an array of people from across the political spectrum (including the head of the Anti-Defamation League and its fiercest critic, author Norman Finkelstein) and traveling to places like Auschwitz (alongside Israeli school kids) and Brooklyn (to explore reports of violence against Jews), Shamir discovers the realities of anti-Semitism today. His findings are shocking, enlightening and – surprisingly – often wryly funny.

    __________________________________________________ _______________

    ‘Defamation’ – Astonishing New Film On Anti-Semitism Reviewed
    By Gilad Atzmon
    1/15/2010

    I urge every person on this planet to watch Yoav Shamir’s ‘Defamation’ documentary about anti Semitism.

    (Note – Both YouTube and Channel 4 Have Blocked Access To The Film)

    To watch the entire film:

    Link (EDIT: The film in the previous link is not working, please click this link to watch the film.)

    The film is an astonishing exposure of the morbid conditions that entangle contemporary Jewish secular identity. It explores and ridicules the current notion of anti Semitism and the lobbies that are engaged in disseminating such a fear. It also exposes those Jewish ethnic campaigners who, for some reason, insist on shaping their identity around the phantasmic idea of being ‘racially’ chased, defamed or hated.

    Being an Israeli, Yoav Shamir, the man behind the film, has managed to infiltrate into Abe Foxman’s ADL. He even managed to join
    Foxman’s ‘international mission’. Shamir also followed an Israeli high school expedition to Auschwitz. He provides us with some intimate footage of Israeli youth being indoctrinated into collective anxiety and total neurosis just before they join the IDF.



    The general image we are left with is no less than grotesque. The film elaborates on the aggressive vulgar orchestrated amplification of fear amongst Israelis and Zionist Jews. “We are raised to believe that we are hated” says an Israeli high school girl on her way to a concentration camp. “ADL provide us with a platform to be Jewish”, says an American elder Jewish woman.

    Shamir provides us with an opportunity to see how badly young Israelis behave once in Poland. You watch their contempt to the local population and disrespect to Polish people and institutes. You can also watch Israelis project their hatred onto others. For some reason they are convinced that everyone out there is as merciless as they happen to be. The Israeli youngsters are saturated with fear, yet, they are having a good time, you can watch them having a party dancing in a bus all the way to a Auschwitz. You can see them munching crisps while watching a Musleman* prisoners drinking his watered-down soup.



    Dancing all the way to Auschwitz

    Shamir provides us with some unusual pictures of Abe Foxman mixing with world leaders. Proudly the ADL leader is insisting on selling his favourite product. Shamir presents the ADL’s deal in some very plain words. “We (the ADL) will be your allies in the American Congress, all we need in return is you fighting anti Semitism along with us”. Shamir realises that if Foxman and the ADL can guarantee a free pass to the American corridors of power, then the ‘anti Semitic’ message explored by the ‘Protocols of the Elders Of Zion’ is rather relevant and should be discussed in the open.

    We can see Foxman and his international mission talking to the Ukrainian President assuring him that the ADL could easily help him in America as long as he doesn’t “link the Holocaust and theHolodomor (the Ukrainian Holocaust)”. “It will be counter effective” if you make such a link” Foxman tells the Ukrainian leader.

    One may wonder how come Foxman who makes a living out of Jewish disasters is so reluctant to allow the Ukrainians to reflect on their past or to share it with others?

    Good question indeed, I believe that primarily it is Jewishchoseness that is coming into play here. Foxman doesn’t like hisraison d’ętre i.e. the Holocaust, to be in competition, eclipsed or even being challenged by any other genocide. But it goes further, as Harvard Professor Yuri Slezkine’s confirms in his master piece The Jewish Century, Jews were actually “Stalin’s willing executioners”. Bolshevik Jews were largely involved in the genocidal crime against the Ukranian people and others. In case one wants to read about ‘Stalin’s Jews’ in an Israeli Zionist paper. Ynet’s Sever Plocker is a good place to start. “We mustn’t forget that some of the greatest murderers of modern times were Jewish” says Zionist Plocker. Abe Foxman must know it all. He insists that the Ukrainians should not link their horrifying past to the Shoabecause he knows that too many of his people are directly involved in the crimes against the Ukrainian people.



    Interestingly enough, in the film, it is the orthodox Jews who defy the cry for anti Semitism. It is a Rabbi who argues that Abe Foxman creates anti Semitism “because he needs a job”. Another Rabbi argues that unlike orthodox Jews who intrinsically associate their Jewishness with Judaism, the cry for anti Semitism is a Jewish secular phenomenon that satisfies the secular Jew’s craving for identity. This indeed makes a lot of sense, once you take Judaism from the Jew all you are left with is ‘chicken soup’ and ‘anti Semitism’. Foxman had to choose whether to open a kosher delicatessen or chasing anti Semites. He clearly has chosen the latter. He and his crypto Zionists within the left and the media are making a career amplifying the fear of being chased.

    Unlike Uri Avneri and Norman Finkelstein who appear in the film and argue that anti Semitism is exaggerated, I actually believe that resentment towards Jewish politics is rising rapidly and constantly. However, I do differentiate between the Judeo centric notion of anti Semitism and political resentment towards Jewish ideology. I do not regard anti Jewish activity as a form of anti-Semitism or racial hatred for Jews are neither Semites nor do they form a racial continuum whatsoever.

    The rise of hatred towards any form of Jewish politics and Jewish lobbies is a reaction towards a tribal, chauvinist and supremacist ideology. If political Jews whether Zionist or ‘Jewish anti Zionists’ are concerned with themselves losing popularity, all they need to do, is to learn to look in the mirror. Self-reflection is liberation as long as one is courageous enough to face the truth.

    Link (EDIT: The film in the previous link is not working, please click this link to watch the film.)
    Link above. If link not working, PM me.

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  11. #101
    Senior Member robitusson has a reputation beyond repute robitusson has a reputation beyond repute robitusson has a reputation beyond repute robitusson has a reputation beyond repute robitusson has a reputation beyond repute robitusson has a reputation beyond repute robitusson has a reputation beyond repute robitusson has a reputation beyond repute robitusson has a reputation beyond repute robitusson has a reputation beyond repute robitusson has a reputation beyond repute robitusson's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Benedict XVI View Post
    Abe Foxman creates anti Semitism “because he needs a job”.



    Looks worth a watch.

    Shame real anti-Semitic bigots like the op of this thread will doubtless
    use it in their anti-Jewish toolbox.

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  12. #102
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    I have a problem with the word anti-semitic. Linguistically Arabs and Arameans are also semitic.
    God is dead, and I'm not feeling too well myself.
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  13. #103
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bird71 View Post
    I have a problem with the word anti-semitic. Linguistically Arabs and Arameans are also semitic.
    Correct, bird.

    The entire label of "Anti-Semiticism" regarding Jewish persecution is not only a misnomer, but propaganda.

    I heard Ben Stein accuse someone of saying "Anti-Semitic" things on Larry King 2 weeks ago on Youtube.

    The term is used to promote Zionist interests in my opinion.

    Persecution has occurred against Jews, no doubt. And this persecution was wrong, IMO. (Pogroms, Spanish Inquisition, WWII etc).

    But most Jews are not semitic in Israel. Many are descendents of the Khazars. And as yo state, the Palis and other Arab people in Levantine are Semitic.

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  14. #104
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    Hey I was called anti Semitic in this thread. Yippie I've finally been placed in a box so now the characterization can begin.

    For Fucks sake, anyone who knows a little bit about the history of Zionism and how zionism has changed over the years in terms of ideology, size, ethnic and religious composition would have known that the OP is bollocks to begin with as he negates his own proposition with the first sentence in the article. And even if the composition of the Zionist movement hadn't changed it would be utterly laughable.

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    Senior Member wangsuda has a reputation beyond repute wangsuda has a reputation beyond repute wangsuda has a reputation beyond repute wangsuda has a reputation beyond repute wangsuda has a reputation beyond repute wangsuda has a reputation beyond repute wangsuda has a reputation beyond repute wangsuda has a reputation beyond repute wangsuda has a reputation beyond repute wangsuda has a reputation beyond repute wangsuda has a reputation beyond repute wangsuda's Avatar
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    You know, the word "Zionist" was used about 100 times on this thread. Do any of you actually know what that word means? I know the Jew-haters don't.

    BTW Larkinney, while your feeling sorry for your Palestinian brethren, why don't you take care of them? Or better yet, read the history regarding the start of the "conflict," and learn how your wise and peace-loving Palestinian leaders were ordering their comrades to death, while they fled to safety.

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