Bush accuses Iran of destabilising the Middle East - Page 5 - Ajarn Forum

re_fuse · 17th May 2008, 11:11

I salute that supposition

Intrepid · 17th May 2008, 16:35

A soldier with the courage and conviction to stand up to the Bush militaristic regime.

It's not mutiny in my books, when the war they are being sent to fight in is so wrong, and based on false pretences. An illegal war indeed.

nuckingfutz · 17th May 2008, 16:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fortesque Smythe Brown

I presume nuckingfutz you have never gone to play soldiers and been involved in combat ?

And you would presume wrong. From the absolute crap you've written here, it is painfully obvious that you have never seen combat. You describe it like a news reporter. So, quit your damned lying about being involved (and probably any military service at all) and quit while you're ahead. If there's anything worse than a soldier who signs on and receives the benefits of being a soldier, then somehow thinks he has a conscience one day, its a person who pretends that they've seen hostile fire. You have been outed. So STFU. If you want to have opinions on Bush, et al., fine. I couldn't give a rat's ass about your opinion on Bush. But you start spewing about soldiering, you've crossed a line and you're in a place where you have no business being. STEP OFF.

Intrepid · 17th May 2008, 17:13

you dont need to have been a soldier to know right from wrong

and Iraq is wrong, has been wrong from Day 1

re_fuse · 17th May 2008, 17:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by nuckingfutz

And you would presume wrong. From the absolute crap you've written here, it is painfully obvious that you have never seen combat. You describe it like a news reporter. So, quit your damned lying about being involved (and probably any military service at all) and quit while you're ahead. If there's anything worse than a soldier who signs on and receives the benefits of being a soldier, then somehow thinks he has a conscience one day, its a person who pretends that they've seen hostile fire. You have been outed. So STFU. If you want to have opinions on Bush, et al., fine. I couldn't give a rat's ass about your opinion on Bush. But you start spewing about soldiering, you've crossed a line and you're in a place where you have no business being. STEP OFF.

Your right in the actual fact of the word "soldier" The good poster Fortesque Smythe Brown was indeed not a soldier he was an officer and indeed from his manner and behavior a gentalman also.

nuckingfutz I'm writing this as a former soldier and officer. And then as a civilian who has stared down the barrels of more guns than you could imagine... If I had possesion of a firearm in some of those moments there might have been a few agressors shot by my self on the basis of those idiots obeying illegal orders from corrupt comanders ( I'm talking army and police here)

There are many opportunities in life where to do the right thing one must step outside of black and white areas and vacilliate in the grey area....Like in the movies the hardboiled dectective has to leave the force to become a private eye and walk a fine line in legality to finally come out the other side .

The good guys don't always wear white hats and the bad guys don't always wear black hats.

and the beer is just kicking in

Fortesque Smythe Brown · 17th May 2008, 19:35

re _fuse

I know you not ,however you are frightenly on target regarding my past,weird !! Indeed the experiences there after in a non military scenario, a parallel world it would seem

Nuckingfutz.

you should be returning to the institution you appear to have been recently released from as sadly the cure has not worked sir !!

I allow myself to ''Have a conscience'' as that is what seperates us from the animal kingdom that you so plainly belong in

I never was,nor ever have even desired to be a reporter, those reporters I met in the field were indeed brave men and women with principals unlike you.They told the truth that was censored from the actual innocent public who in many case were sacrificing their sons on the altar on a nations leaders meglomania and American hype in Vietnam and all the other places the U.S.A. have screwed up. Bay of Pigs, My Lai massacre and many more too,do they ring a bell to you sir ?

Such matters are honourable conduct in your eyes I wonder ?

You may live in a fantasy world, I do not nor ever did I feel the same goes for others who have replied to your post.

''Crossing the line'' is the expression you used. Does that infer that you crossed the equetar on some jolly on a cruise ship perhaps and participated in the frivolities associated with such an event ?

Dare I ask if you are above the age of military service or are you just a plain loud mouthed cowardly heckler sir ?

Or should SIR be spelt CUR in your case ?

I honoured my commission to the full as did many others .

What about you ?

Farangrakthai · 18th May 2008, 10:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by esoteric1

I'd say the ones who don't ask any questions, and are only "just following orders" are the ones who don't have a set.

interesting to hear what Sanchez has to say about this.

Quote:

full article at Sanchez may have been commander in Iraq, but he says he was just following orders - Yahoo! News

Sanchez may have been commander in Iraq, but he says he was just following orders
By Nancy A. Youssef, McClatchy NewspapersFri May 16, 4:50 PM ET

WASHINGTON — To hear retired Army Lt. Gen. Ricardo Sanchez explain it, the mistakes of the Iraq war that happened while he was in command there weren't his fault. Not Abu Ghraib, not the birth of the insurgency, not the decision to let rebel cleric Muqtada al Sadr survive.

Sanchez was a soldier, and according to him, a general's job is to give advice. What the civilian leaders decide after that is out of a general's hands.

"It's our responsibility to provide the best judgment we can," Sanchez said in an interview with McClatchy . "But when those decisions are made, if they are not illegal or immoral, civilian control of the military dictates that we comply."

His explanation is part of an ongoing debate within the military, triggered by the Iraq quagmire: What is the role of a soldier?

Sanchez's comments were part of a series of interviews he's given recently to promote his new autobiography, "Wiser in Battle: A Soldier's Story," the latest of several books by key Iraq decision-makers that seem intended to exonerate them of responsibility. In his book, Sanchez repeatedly spells out instances in which civilian leaders made decisions that countered his recommendations.

Sanchez said he advised President Bush not to go into Fallujah in April 2004 after four private security contractors were taken hostage and killed. Their burned bodies were hung from a bridge as Iraqis celebrated beneath them. The widely circulated photos were grotesque.

Sanchez said that he should have known more about what was going on at the Abu Ghraib prison, where Iraqi prisoners were subjected to degrading treatment that resulted in the courts-martial of seven low-ranking soldiers.

But even there, he said he bore no direct responsibility for what was taking place. Instead, the abuses of Abu Ghraib were a result of the Bush administration's endorsement of aggressive interrogations, which began in Afghanistan . He points out that an Army inspector general report ultimately absolved him.

"One of the things that has frustrated me in this war— everybody sees the military commander as the one responsible for the conduct of the war on the ground when in fact it's about the application of national power across the entire spectrum, and (the general) doesn't control it," he said.

Fortesque Smythe Brown · 18th May 2008, 12:23

It was rather amusing to see how the Saudi's treated Bush .WITH CONTEMPT !!!!!

George has served his purpose and kept the elite thieves in power in Saudi,they know he is on his way out and now the Arabs are calling their debts in.

Possibly the commentthat the Israeli's are ''The Chosen Race'' didn't actually help to strengthen the ties between Saudi and America either,

A great vote catcher in the upcoming American Knesset (OOPS, sorry),American presidential elections as the Jewish vote is a big one, however,a bit tactless in solving the current problem bedevilling our world.

Well done George Witless Bush.

theent01 · 18th May 2008, 14:33

i'm sorry, but nuckingfutz HAS to be storekeeper. How was box-counting in Japan?

preezeplessone · 19th May 2008, 04:52

It's well know that Iran has been supplying Hezbollah with weapons.

re_fuse · 19th May 2008, 05:01

yeah but who's been giving storekeeper weapons ?

i1der · 19th May 2008, 05:04

It's time to vote..Go Barak Obama.

Oop! wrong thread...did anyone dropped anything on Iran yet?

Uncle Harry · 19th May 2008, 05:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by preezeplessone

It's well know that Iran has been supplying Hezbollah with weapons.

Maybe, but why shouldn't they seeing as the US gives billions in money and weapons to Israel.

theent01 · 19th May 2008, 06:55

and they have a right to influence events in the neighboring countries, if they don't things like the Iran-Iraq war happen, and millions die. In my opinion, they have a lot more right to be involved in Iraq than we do.