Thread: Bush accuses Iran of destabilising the Middle East

Originally Posted by Fortesque Smythe Brown

Nuckingfutz.

you should be returning to the institution you appear to have been recently released from as sadly the cure has not worked sir !!

I allow myself to ''Have a conscience'' as that is what seperates us from the animal kingdom that you so plainly belong in

I never was,nor ever have even desired to be a reporter, those reporters I met in the field were indeed brave men and women with principals unlike you.They told the truth that was censored from the actual innocent public who in many case were sacrificing their sons on the altar on a nations leaders meglomania and American hype in Vietnam and all the other places the U.S.A. have screwed up. Bay of Pigs, My Lai massacre and many more too,do they ring a bell to you sir ?

Such matters are honourable conduct in your eyes I wonder ?

You may live in a fantasy world, I do not nor ever did I feel the same goes for others who have replied to your post.

''Crossing the line'' is the expression you used. Does that infer that you crossed the equetar on some jolly on a cruise ship perhaps and participated in the frivolities associated with such an event ?

Dare I ask if you are above the age of military service or are you just a plain loud mouthed cowardly heckler sir ?

Or should SIR be spelt CUR in your case ?

I honoured my commission to the full as did many others .

What about you ?

Good God, man! Where did you learn to write such drivel?

Two things:

1) I now am 100% sure you never served in any capacity in any military anywhere. Your ridiculously worded post only serves as evidence to that fact. I have my doubts about re_fuse too. Too much bluster about nothing.

2)The time to have a conscience is when you sign the enlistment papers, not when ordered to do something you don't like. While you and I both don't like what has happened in Iraq, it certainly hasn't been deemed illegal, no matter how much you want it to be. What kind of military would a nation have if its soldiers were allowed to pick and choose which conflicts in which they would go to fight? Would it be like the British military? The Australian army perhaps? I think it must then be like the Canadian forces.

I stand by my original statement. There should be NO leniency with this coward, not matter how much conscience he decided to gain when finding out he must go to Iraq.

Originally Posted by re_fuse

^ can I have a retraction there mate ?

Sure. I retract my doubts but I still think you bluster about nothing.

Originally Posted by re_fuse

You know I would have no hesitation in pulling the trigger if I was fighting for my life or the life of others , but if they sent me to subdue some heresy in a third world sovereign nation and ordered me to shoot defenceless civilian's who were acting in defiance of the military invaders I would refuse that order and have no hesitation at all in using my firearm to arrest the person giving that order and if need be shooting that person to prevent them killing non combatants.

Yes, you sound like an honorable enough fella, but wtf does this have to do with the coward who thinks he should be able to pick and choose which action he sees? Look, things are bad enough in Iraq without having to resort to tall tales to make it look worse. Any "defenseless" civilians shot at were the ones that would not stop at road blocks, etc. To make it sound as if soldiers walk the streets shooting at anything that moves is downright ludicrous. Is it common practice in the Australian military to refuse orders? Sounds to me like you would be dangerous to those around you.

Originally Posted by nuckingfutz

but wtf does this have to do with the coward who thinks he should be able to pick and choose which action he sees?

i would not be so presumptuous as to even guess at what was going through his mind ....But it is his mind and a person does have the inalienable right to follow their own mind.

Originally Posted by nuckingfutz

Look, things are bad enough in Iraq without having to resort to tall tales to make it look worse.

I would not know that ..having to rely on the media which has no interest in depicting objective reality.

Originally Posted by nuckingfutz

Any "defenseless" civilians shot at were the ones that would not stop at road blocks,

I suppose those who were in their houses unarmed at the time should have learnt to stop at road blocks .

Originally Posted by nuckingfutz

To make it sound as if soldiers walk the streets shooting at anything that moves is downright ludicrous

It does happen ...you have never been on tour have you ?

Originally Posted by nuckingfutz

Is it common practice in the Australian military to refuse orders? Sounds to me like you would be dangerous to those around you

If an illegal order is given then it does happen.
The Charge for refusing orders is worded " Disobeying a lawful command" ..... If the command was unlawful and you refused ..... Then your not going to be charged because the order was not lawful ....and the person giving the order is liable for court marshall.

As you are probably aware the Nuremberg defence does not work in the modern world.

Originally Posted by re_fuse

It does happen ...you have never been on tour have you ?

Yes, it does happen but it rarely happens as a result of orders given. And, yes, I have been on tour, but it was long ago and not something I usually discuss. As you probably know, I saw and did things that will remain with me forever.

Originally Posted by re_fuse

If an illegal order is given then it does happen.
The Charge for refusing orders is worded " Disobeying a lawful command" ..... If the command was unlawful and you refused ..... Then your not going to be charged because the order was not lawful ....and the person giving the order is liable for court marshall.

Of course it happens, but I'm not aware that it happens often. If you refuse a direct order, you'd better be damned sure that it is illegal. If your refusal costs lives, then god help you because no one else will. At least that's the way it was when I served.

And what about the genocide in Burma? Who will step up? The only thing I am sorry for is the landing on Normandy Beach, 64 years ago. If it weren't for that, we wouldn't have so many pedophile TEFL from Europe, parading around, telling us Americans how we should run our country. FYI, America is not a socialist' nation; most of Europe is--and you can have your 10 dollar shepard's pie (would be with shnitzel if it weren't for our B-29's) and warm putrid beer, and boiled veggies. I wouldn't go there to throw up. In case the Prathom kids didn't tell you, the King is American, too.

Originally Posted by preezeplessone

And what about the genocide in Burma? Who will step up? The only thing I am sorry for is the landing on Normandy Beach, 64 years ago. If it weren't for that, we wouldn't have so many pedophile TEFL from Europe, parading around, telling us Americans how we should run our country. FYI, America is not a socialist' nation; most of Europe is--and you can have your 10 dollar shepard's pie (would be with shnitzel if it weren't for our B-29's) and warm putrid beer, and boiled veggies. I wouldn't go there to throw up. In case the Prathom kids didn't tell you, the King is American, too.

Spot on. I've noticed as well that there are no threads and no mention of the situation in Burma. Why don't the circle-jerkers want to talk about that? They're busy doing thread after boring thread of George Bush and bad religion.

Your Pièce de résistance sir:

...and you can have your 10 dollar shepard's pie (would be with shnitzel if it weren't for our B-29's) and warm putrid beer, and boiled veggies. I wouldn't go there to throw up.

Well put

Originally Posted by preezeplessone

And what about the genocide in Burma? Who will step up? The only thing I am sorry for is the landing on Normandy Beach, 64 years ago. If it weren't for that, we wouldn't have so many pedophile TEFL from Europe, parading around, telling us Americans how we should run our country. FYI, America is not a socialist' nation; most of Europe is--and you can have your 10 dollar shepard's pie (would be with shnitzel if it weren't for our B-29's) and warm putrid beer, and boiled veggies. I wouldn't go there to throw up. In case the Prathom kids didn't tell you, the King is American, too.

if you can't win the argument, change the subject.

Originally Posted by esoteric1

I believe there have been, and I may have missed some.

http://www.ajarnforum.net/vb/the-soa...aftermath.html (Possibility of a coup taking place in Myanmar during the aftermath?)

http://www.ajarnforum.net/vb/the-vir...-in-burma.html

http://www.ajarnforum.net/vb/the-vir...suffocate.html

http://www.ajarnforum.net/vb/the-soa...-20-years.html (Burma march 'largest in 20 years')

I didn't look on the virtual pub forum which is where the largest thread resides and I missed the 6-post beast here in the Soap Box. The other two threads you listed had nothing to do with the cyclone and the aftermath in Myanmar.

Originally Posted by esoteric1

So it's not as if he's a coward in the sense of trying to avoid combat.

It would take a brave man to go against what all his mates were for and a even braver man would follow his convictions knowingly up against criminal charges.