Thread: Top Shelf Koran: UK Appeases Muslims Once Again

Originally Posted by tropic of cancer

I've no doubt you're right - though isn't the story's evident plausibility almost as germane.

Well religions of any stripe produce some very odd people.
Some people believe all you should be able to buy on a Sunday is a bible.
But because these views are more familiar to western readers, people who are not religious zealots are able to see this simply as being a bit 'whacky', for want of a better word.
Because of this it is not 'news' or 'germane' to any particular discussion.

However if you switch this to 'the koran' and 'muslims' you will quickly garner a lot of interest in any totally fabricated or heavily slanted story.

Easy as 1-2-3 for any lazy journalist.

Heck, even the most dim witted internet forum contributors can start threads on the 'topic' now.

Originally Posted by Cyrille

Some people believe all you should be able to buy on a Sunday is a bible.

They don't at the moment firebomb the embassies of countries harbouring infidel cartoonists however.

All religious nutjobs think you're off to Hell if you're not like them/do as they instruct: the key difference with muslim nutters is they're intent on dispatching you there themselves (a highly 'germane' distinction if you ask me).

I happen to admire an awful lot about the religion of Islam and the way many Muslims live their lives. However, the insistence of all Muslims that the Koran is the unmediated word of God acts as a permanent tether on its development into something which can take its place in a tolerant, developed socio-political sphere.

Originally Posted by tropic of cancer

the insistence of all Muslims that the Koran is the unmediated word of God

Surely you don't think all muslims 'insist' on this?

There are thousands of Muslims just in the UK who give this as much thought as most Christians give to the Old Testament..

Such a demand doesn't do much for moderate Islam.

Originally Posted by tropic of cancer

They don't at the moment firebomb the embassies of countries harbouring infidel cartoonists however.

No - they favour murdering doctors who carry out abortions.

Originally Posted by Cyrille

Surely you don't think all muslims 'insist' on this?

..

Yes, to be a muslim it is required to believe exactly this, and this is the key structural flaw in the religion. Different interpretations exist as to what it (the Koran) is saying but to doubt that God dictated it is apostasy. The centrality of the text itself (as opposed to any interpretive form of its message) is hard-wired into the religion.

A well written argument here sums up my thoughts on radical Islam and the war on terror

A LOOK IN THE ISLAMIC MIRROR

Terrorism. A world in a perilous battle with an evil so grave, so completely merciless and diabolical, that one can barely look at the pictures of the men responsible for their "killing in the name of God". How can they take weapons and bombs, kill innocent civilians and children, and somehow twist that into something that God would want them to do? No matter how evil they think the enemy is, no matter how right they think they are, how can they possibly justify this kind of behavior?

They must be jealous of our wealth. They must hate us for our freedom. They must think we are evil because of the way our women dress. They must hate us just because we don't believe in their God. Maybe they hate us because we have so much to eat, so much to be thankful for.

Radical Islam is a grave and present danger on the world stage today, there is no question about that. Osama Bin Laden's form of Islam is constantly decried by Muslims all over the world as a perversion of the Islamic faith. Muslims in London today said that exact thing about the men who bombed the subways and bus there. "Islam is about peace, not killing, and this activity has nothing to do with Islam." So there is an enormous portion of Islamic people in the world that not only don't spend all their time plotting to kill Christians, and Americans in particular. I wonder what those Islamic people think of the current American occupation in Iraq? I wonder what they think as they watch Al-Jazera, and see American soldiers and bombs killing non military civilians, and children?

A LOOK IN THE CHRISTIAN MIRROR

The War on Terror. A world in a perilous battle with an evil so grave, so completely merciless and diabolical, that one can barely look at the pictures of the men responsible for their "killing in the name of God". How can they take weapons and bombs, kill innocent civilians and children, and somehow twist that into something that God would want them to do? No matter how evil they think the enemy is, no matter how right they think they are, how can they possibly justify this kind of behavior?

They must be jealous of our Oil. They must hate us because we are oppressed. They must think we are evil because of the way our women dress. They must hate us because we don't believe in their God. They must hate us because we have so little to eat, and so little to be thankful for.

Militant Christianity is a clear and present danger on the world stage today, there is no question about that. George Bush's form of Christianity is constantly being decried by Christians all over the world as a perversion of the Christian faith. Many Christians in America today say that exact thing about the War on Terror. "Christianity is about loving your enemies, and doing good to those who spitefully use you and mistreat you, and this war has nothing to do with Christianity." Had enough?


STOP COMPARING US TO THEM!!

Why? Why would I not compare us to them, when we are doing the EXACT SAME THINGS THEY DO? Come on face it Christian, you are sitting there saying THAT'S DIFFERENT. Well I have news for you if you are saying that... IT'S NOT! It is insanity to think that insanity stops insanity!

It is equally as evil for Christians to kill after they get baptized in the little pool outside the barracks before they kill entire cities full of people in honor of Jesus Christ, as it is for a man to strap a bomb on his chest and run into a crowd of innocents in honor of "Allah".

It is equally as evil for large groups of Christians, (The Evangelical Church) to raise their fists and cry God Bless America, and hail their leader as "God's man" as he kills thousands, as it is for large groups of Muslims (radical Islam) to raise their fist and cry Jihad, and hail their leader as a prophet, while he kills thousands.

It is every bit as evil for America to engage in "Just Wars", as it is for Islam to engage in "Jihad"

It is every bit as manipulative and hypocritical to say Islam is "The Face of Satan", as it is to say that America is the "Great Satan".

Finally, it is every bit as deceived to say that God is with us when we kill them, as it is to say that God is with them when they kill us.

As for Christians, from Wiikipedia:

1 Christian terrorist organizations
1.1 Anti-abortion terrorists
1.2 Transnational groups
1.2.1 Christian Identity
1.2.2 Identity doctrine
1.3 Groups in the United States
1.3.1 Army of God

In 1985 Rev. Mike Bray, the "chaplain" of the Army of God,[14] was convicted of destroying seven abortion facilities in Delaware, Maryland, Virginia, and the District of Columbia, causing damages of over $1 million. Rev. Paul Hill, an associate of the Army of God, shot and killed Dr. John Britton in Pensacola, Florida in 1994.[15]:11 James Kopp, a member of the Army of God, shot and killed Dr. Barnett Slepian in 1998.[16]

In 1998, letters were sent to news organizations and law enforcement claiming the Army of God carried out several of the attacks attributed to Eric Rudolph.

In 2001, at the height of the United States anthrax attacks, more than 170 abortion clinics and doctors offices in 14 states received letters containing white powder and the message "You have been exposed to anthrax. We are going to kill all of you. Army of God, Virginia DARE Chapter."[17] In December 2003 Clayton Waagner was convicted for these attacks.

1.3.2 Aryan Nations
1.3.3 Christian Patriots
1.3.4 Ku Klux Klan
1.4 Groups in Indonesia
1.5 Groups in India
1.5.1 National Liberation Front of Tripura
1.5.2 Nagaland Rebels
1.6 Groups in Lebanon
1.6.1 Guardians of the Cedars
1.6.2 Lebanese Forces
1.7 Groups in Northern Ireland
1.7.1 Religion as a factor
1.7.2 Groups
1.8 Groups in Russia
1.8.1 Russian National Unity
1.8.2 Russian National Socialists
1.9 Groups in Serbia
1.9.1 Tsar Lazar Guard
1.9.2 White Eagles
1.10 Other national groups
1.10.1 God's Army, Burma
1.10.2 Sons of Freedom, Canada
1.10.3 The Lord's Resistance Army, Uganda

That's a lot of Christian terrorists, fighting in the name of their Christian God. Cyrille mentioned the abortion terrorists and I've included a few details in the quote. I'd add the rest of this list to the absolute shits that are Christian terrorists. I have no doubt you'll find a long list of Islamic terrorists, maybe fewer, maybe more, it doesn't matter. My point is, all religions create terror. Their foundations are built on building terror. "If you don't come to church every Sunday, you'll go to hell. If you don't give the collection 10% of your income every Sunday, you're going to hell." Fuck you religion.

Originally Posted by naboo

"If you don't come to church every Sunday, you'll go to hell. If you don't give the collection 10% of your income every Sunday, you're going to hell." Fuck you religion.

I've been a Christian my entire life and I've NEVER heard anything remotely like this from anyone.

And just for saying that....you're going to hell.

"kansas. as dumb as you think"


a good wind up pan.

Originally Posted by panhunger

Muslim nutjobs trigger more death and destruction than Christian nutjobs.

Christian nutjob George W Bush renders that claim farcical.

Originally Posted by naboo

A well written argument here sums up my thoughts on radical Islam and the war on terror



As for Christians, from Wiikipedia:



That's a lot of Christian terrorists, fighting in the name of their Christian God. Cyrille mentioned the abortion terrorists and I've included a few details in the quote. I'd add the rest of this list to the absolute shits that are Christian terrorists. I have no doubt you'll find a long list of Islamic terrorists, maybe fewer, maybe more, it doesn't matter. My point is, all religions create terror. Their foundations are built on building terror. "If you don't come to church every Sunday, you'll go to hell. If you don't give the collection 10% of your income every Sunday, you're going to hell." Fuck you religion.

George Bush is a christian nutter but the war in Iraq was a geo-political one - it was not about trying to turn everyone Christian, or killing them because they weren't. It would be impossible in a Western society to advance such a raison d'etre. Baldly, this is because we've benifitted from an Enlightenment (and the Islamic world has not).

Western Muslims know this, which is why they fall with relish upon the 'I'm only a terrorist (appeaser) because of what you're doing to Muslim babies' argument whenever they have a credulous cultural-relativist Western liberal audience, but are then caught on camera in the mosque down the road breathing evangelical fire and brimstone calling for an Islamic World Order.

A Christian Evangelical President has been a gift to hand-wringers in the West determined to bite the hand that feeds them but really it must be said:

there is no equivalence between a pluralist liberal capitalist society (which is capable of electing crass malignancy) and the ideology of nihilistic Islamo-fascism (which is crass malignancy).