Yesterday I received some fairly disturbing news from my employer (agency) and I kindly ask for anyone who may have some constructive ideas or solutions to my problem.
I have been working in Thailand as a serious and dedicated English teacher for 18 months now. I completed my TEFL in Phuket and gained a work permit under the guise of yes, “a fake degree from Koa San Rd”. I don’t have a bachelor degree in any field so that’s what my employer asked me to do to get around the problem of working in Thailand.
I do have a trade certificate in Dispensing Optics, 2 certificates in Internal Auditing, and a long 12 years work experience in the real world from qualified tradesman, leading hand, staff trainer, and 6 years as an internal auditor before arriving in Thailand. I also applied to uni 3 weeks ago for a bachelor degree in further education and training. That’s all beside the point. I just want you to understand I am no backpacker teacher, and I don’t want this to become another debate about uni degree vs no uni degree.
My problem began yesterday when my employer told me that I have no job as of the end of the month. Reason being, when he went to apply for my new work permit last week, the man in the employment office picked up that my degree was a fake. I was refused a work permit and my name has been blacklisted. I now don’t know what my options are.
If I try to get a job in a new school, new province etc, will the employment office (in a different province) pick it up? Are they connected nationally? How do I tell my potential new employer of this and still expect to get the job?
The way I see it I have 3 bad options. 1 - Move and try for a new job in a new province and not say anything and hope that I pull it off. 2 – Work illegally on a tourist visa in a school that’s prepared to cooperate. 3 – Return to Australia and complete my degree there.
In summary. Option 1 is risky. Option 2 is riskier and for me out of the question. I don’t want to be doing visa runs every month. Option 3 is also complicated by the fact that I have a serious Thai GF. We have been living together for over a year now and the thought of having to leave her behind kills me. If it wasn’t for this fact, I’d go home in a flash and get a degree.
Two questions for you all.
1 - Any suggestions? 2 - Is anyone looking for a professional and dedicated teacher that’s prepared to hire me in light of what my situation is?
Regards
Not so Lovinlife :sad:
If this story is for real and your employer was being straight with you, I think your analysis of the situation is pretty much spot on. I sympathise with you, but I think you're headed back to Oz for awhile. Good luck.
"Steven"
"Teachers, we are having some technical problems with our PA system. If you are having any difficulty hearing this announcement, please send a student to the main office to let us know."
Heard in a U.S. Public School
i wouldn't be too down old boy, all is far from lost!
first, check with ken or pinky whether your employer's story is true...is it likely they really did pick up the fake degree? are you really blacklisted? all these things won't help a great deal but they will give you a good idea of whether you're being lied to or not. there may be other reasons why your employer is letting you go.
the way i see it you got two options-
1. your option 2, work illegally. i don't see why this is 'out of the question' for you. i've never done it and personally wouldn't be too comfortable doing it but many, many do and with very few problems. the visa run thing is a bitch but there are worse things.
2. go back and get your degree. always a great option. get it. if yu're relationship is worth anything, you'll be fine. could she come to oz with you maybe? or if not, you could always visit.
all in all, i don't think you have to worry. you seem sensible and committed, you'll be fine.
I feel very sorry for you but at the end of the day you did cheat in picking up one of those fake degrees. Then again if your school told you to get one they are equally fiendish.
Off topic a friend of mine managed to get into the Wentworth World Matchplay on a fake press pass.
I have heard similar stories here in BKK, teachers with genuine degrees have been told that theirs are fake even after the degrees being certified at their embassy.
The latest thing I heard and I have no way of confirming this, is that some schools have been blacklisted for not paying taxes. The tax people have told the Ministry of Labour and the Ministry of Education not to issue work permits or teacher's licences to employees of these 'blacklisted' schools until they pay their back taxes.
Your employer was probably told 'No more work permits for your school until you pay your taxes' and to save his face when talking to you told you the 'fake' reason.
As Unwell said, All is not lost. I'll pm you
Find it a bit suspect myself as usually it's the MoE that would reject it, not the Labour dept. IME and IMO.
Also if thay had have found it, I'd guess they'd have taken some kind of action, that they haven't gives me the impression the story is maybe not on the up and up.
You'll be okay IMO in a different province, although with the new verification procedure don't expect to get a WP anytime soon with a dodgy degree (unless you work for a very naive school, or one that likes taking risks). I know someone who had a similar problem and he was fine working elsewhere.
It is possible to get a WP without a degree (for sure), but you'll need your current or new employer to go to the MoE and vouch for you, after that it should be a doddle.
Option 1 is doable, but you most likely won't get WP.
Option 2 is what many people do, so chances are you'll be fine until the storm blows over.
Option 3 is also doable,but why not think about doing it here if it's hard to get your g/f back to Oz?
I think Hippo might be on to something as well.
I doubt you're blacklisted either.
Riddle me this brother can you handle it
Your style to my style you can't hold a candle to it
Equinox symmetry and the balance is right
Smokin' and drinkin' on a Tuesday night
It's not how you play the game it's how you win it
I cheat and steal and sin and I'm a cynic
Find it a bit suspect myself...my thoughts exacty. have the impression your employer might be making up a few stories...I doubt you're blacklisted either.
"...ever wonder why they kill the weak ones, baby?"
Embassies certify degrees?? That's news to me. Didn't think they were in that line of work.I have heard similar stories here in BKK, teachers with genuine degrees have been told that theirs are fake even after the degrees being certified at their embassy.
What's that procedure, Ken? Is there one?the new verification procedure
I seriously doubt you're bloacklisted and tend to think that your employer is in hot water about something or has other designs that don't include you. The Ministry of Education is the one who rejects/accepts degrees, not the Labor Department.
You're not gonna be run out of the country.
banging the gong...
Yes, they can do (The American one definitely and I think recently Bluffer got his done at the Brit Embassy).Originally Posted by dongintheklong
Yes, there's a thread about it (Macha started). It's now down to the inidividual schools to verify the degrees, not the MoE. This is fucking a lot of people up!What's that procedure, Ken? Is there one?the new verification procedure
I can explain why here...but I'd rather not, so please by all means PM me.
But again this shouldn't effect a renewal which is the case here.
Most Western embassies in most countries have always "certified" degree certificates and other documents. There are actually two different processes. Legalization confirms that the awarding body actually exists. Certification is almost identical to notarization, and simply confirms that a photocopy is a genuine copy of an original document which has been produced to the certifying officer. A third procedure is "apostilization" (Apostile de la Hague), though many embassies will probably not have the faintest idea of what you are talking about if you ask for this.
None of the above procedures are a verification of the actual award of the degree. The embassy does not check with the university to ensure that the certificate is genuine and that the person named therein graduated with the stated qualification.
It is all fairly meaningless (and quite expensive) red tape.
Thanks for the info and clarification, Rumpole.
So in other words the MoE think that they're getting the degree verified (that it's real) when they are basically just accepting a notarized piece of paper?None of the above procedures are a verification of the actual award of the degree. The embassy does not check with the university to ensure that the certificate is genuine and that the person named therein graduated with the stated qualification.
What's the point?
Anyone can get a fake degree on Khao San Road (like the original poster did), take it to their embassy, pay the notarial (?) fee, give it to the MoE and voila! you're accepted!
^ Dong,
Whether the Embassy does it or not, it don't matter the school will take the blame if it's not 'real' nowadays!
So you'll find most schools if they're going to verify will do it proper like at least IMHO!
Rumpole is right as I have stated before. The U.S. Embassy will basically notorize your degree. This is to say they say that you have sworn before a consular official that the document you have presented is real.
I like this thread, teachers trying to help a fellow teacher who is getting shafted in a sense. Good work.
Too long in Exile, too long not singing my song.
Too long like a rolling stone, Too long in exile
Too long in Exile, baby you just arent my friend.
Too long in Exile my friend, Baby you can never go home again.
How is the relevent government department picking up the fakies? Looking at the laser printed signatures under a magnifying glass? An ex colleague of mine recently renewed all his paperwork with no problem and his degree is moodier than a 6 pound note.
It ain't me, it ain't me, I ain't no Interior Minister of Thailand's son.
^ That's why I'm suspicious about what has been said.....don't really make sense.
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