Thread: Nationalism: 'Cos We Is Better Than You Lot

So we've quivered in a corner with Thai culture, we've expressed our pride, or lack of it, in our home countries, and we've asked "Are you an individual- just like everybody else?" so maybe we should run Nationalism up the flagpole and see who salutes it?

I've noticed the Isaanese would much rather be associated with Thailand than Laos, and to speak 'Isaan' (Lao) is considered low-class, even though it's this region's mother tongue. Cambodians are openly joked about, and the provinces like Sisaket, which were formerly part of Cambodia (hence the Preah Vihear temple borderline issue) are laughed at as being very low class indeed, the inhabitants being mostly dark-skinned rice farmers.

California, the jewel in America's crown, was originally Mexican land, yet Americans continually make fun of their Southern and Northern neighbours.....and the rest of the world really. The English poke fun at the Irish, Scots and Welsh with the same sheep shagging jokes that the Australians make at the New Zealander's expense.

The Chinese (someone on here called them the French of Asia) assume superiority above everyone, (and they do a very nice dragon dance it must be said) while the Japanese and Koreans are fond of keeping their 'racial purity' unsullied with foreign blood, (or should that be foreign sperm?)

So, what is your opinion on these somewhat imaginary classifications? Koreans still call themselves Koreans, even though half are living in communist North Korea, while the other half repose in Jimbo-Land. Borders can be changed, 'cultures' are fluid, the original inhabitants of many countries (even Japan) have been displaced and replaced. Do you put your hand on your heart at the rockets red glare? Do you lie back and think of England? Do you, like Peter Allen, still call Australia by phone? What's it all about and why does it even matter?

Originally Posted by WilliamBlake

The English poke fun at the Irish

**Correction** The whole world makes a joke of the Oirish on a daily basis

I personally only ring home once a month to see how my kids are....other than that, it's just e-mails.

Basically I left my country, to work here. I left my culture/food etc. back there. I have basically adopted certain parts of another culture. I can't see the point in looking down on people.... It only makes one as low as snobs that look down on others

I pledge allegiance to whatever nation suits my interests and is of the most benefit to me.
Not an exercise in opportunism but one of realism.
National borders are one day going to be a thing of the past.
Maybe not in my lifetime, but I always like living in the future as it is more comfortable than the present for the rent is already paid.

I was thinking about this recently. In fact I was going to do a thread about it, but it looks like WB has beatne me to it, so I'll stick my tuppence ha'penny in. From our point of view - expats - I think there is a tendency to romanticise our native countries to a certain extent.

I think that expats, especially in places like Thailand and Cambodia and other countries where law enforcement is lax and/or 'negotiable' and where people can, if they wish, give free reign to every weird vice that ever crossed their mind, there is the danger of slipping into a kind of anomie, with no real rules or restrictions or values or meaning or good or bad or anything at all. You are cut off from the norms and rules and customs and values that regulate behaviour back at home, yet you don't understand the norms, rules and values that Thais have which do the same job.

So people slip into a kind of moral vacuum. These are the people who live in lower sukhumvit bars. They're fucked and one look at them and you can tell. It's almost the same as junkies - you can see a smackhead if you know how to look, their skin shimmers with a mixture of desperation and sweat, and you can see these ghosts that haunt the stone tables outside cheap chinese grocers in the alleyways around Nana, nuzzling their beer chang.

Other people cast around for some point of reference and find it in a kind of idealised view of their homeland (and I realise I may be speaking just for myself here). So England for me has become a place of hills and valleys and greenery and countryside walks, and the people there are straightforward and tough and don't whine and complain and all that kind of thing that is all sort of stereotypical and slightly true. Obviously you edit out things such as chavs, increasingly autocratic government, those automated telephone answering services (Thailand is leaps and bounds ahead of the UK when it comes to getting someone on the telephone to help you out), and all the other shit that goes along with UK living.

So, nationalism - when I was living in the UK I couldn't give a fuck being English - nationalism was something associated with far-right politics and the-sun-never-sets-on-the-empire types. Over here I look at the UK, or at least Yorkshire, with VERY rose-tinted spectatcles. Anyone else do the same ?

Originally Posted by jonny danger

The fcukin beaners killed Davey Crockett at The Alamo, and then my friend Teddy Miller in East L.A. (so what if he was wearing red in the blue zone). We took California cause we remembered The Alamo .. so fcukem. And they're still there, greasy bastards, get a job ya fcukin freeloaders, learn to speak English or go back to Mexico (leave the women tho)!

Please please leave the really good authentic restaurants.

What always befuddles me is that the flag waving ex-pat jingoists, are often the same people who are the first to whinge on about how their native country is going down the crapper because of immigrants. The complaint appears to be that economic migrants have the nerve to leave their native countries to find work, and possibly a better lifestyle.

Originally Posted by rogerman

**Correction** The whole world makes a joke of the Oirish on a daily basis

It's been completely uncool in England to make those crap kind of jokes for at least 20 years. I think the last time I heard one was probably watching some wanker like Stan Boardman on telly in 1978 or something.

No such innate thing called nationalism, really.

It's a political instrument, used to rise up the people against perceived enemies, when they are not enemies at all, but obstacles to national political interests and their supporters.

There are suckers for nationalistic fervour, like Xtrafresh, and then there are the enlightened minorities (typically) who understand nationalism is a political tool.

Heil Hitler!

Originally Posted by WilliamBlake

I've noticed the Isaanese would much rather be associated with Thailand than Laos, and to speak 'Isaan' (Lao) is considered low-class, even though it's this region's mother tongue. Cambodians are openly joked about

Don't forget to include the Burmese, Bill. I dislike these attitudes towards the people that are perceived to be of a lower social standing. There are very large communities of Isarn and Burmese down here in Surat as they are essential to the the palm and rubber industries. Many get a bad deal, treated like scum by local plantation owners who see them as nothing more than expendable labour and, to a certain extent, many deserve it for being lazy and unskilled but these are in a minority. I try to employ the same workers every time because they know me, work well for me and know that I will be kind to them and buy them drinks. We sit in the dirt and eat together as equals during our breaks. They're good people and I particularly the Burmese who tend be a bit more open and speak a little English with me even though their Thai is very good.