What's up with the low pay these days?

**The Quiet American** · 14th May 2011 08:01

Originally Posted by tomcat

the swamp will claim you in the end

great post (per usual) Cat

and true

i saw it in a stephen king movie ("creepshow")

**panhunger** · 14th May 2011 08:02

Originally Posted by Bangkok Phil

You can't keep on supplying sub-standard teachers to schools and stay in business.

...and you can't keep paying low wages and expect quality teachers.

**Bangkok Phil** · 14th May 2011 08:04

Originally Posted by panhunger

and you can't keep paying low wages and expect quality teachers.

Well perhaps the penny might drop one day. However, there seems to be more and more people willing to give the agency game a go. If you've got an office and a phone, you're good to go.

**saknat** · 14th May 2011 08:20

Hi There,

You should be thankful for what you get as a salary these days.

Don't forget that Thai's still have a disrespect for us even if we are just earning 25000 bt a month.

I'm on my sixth year of teaching this year and I got a raise for this coming year from the same school .

Being a new school last year the going rate was 20000 bt for 11 months. They were worried about it as I was on 25000 previously.

You have to be flexible here in Thailand as we all know about that.

I accepted eagerly considering it was a new school. New bosses, teachers and students to get use to.

For the previous 4 years I was on 25000 bt a month for 10 months out of the year

The first job in the South (12 teaching hours a week) for 10 months out of the year.
The second job near Chiang Mai for three years (22 teaching hours per week) for 10 months out of the year

The current school further south from Lamphun

Last year 20000 bt (18 teaching hours a week) for 11 months out of the year.
This current year 25000 bt (18 hours a week) for 10 months out of the year.

I do not have a pension or anything like that.

It was a bit difficult for us initially as my wife was a house wife at the time and we had to get other money from my overseas account at times.

My wife had to create a job for herself being older around 32 when we married 6 years ago.
I put her through ajarn yingsac cooking school first before she decided on any kind of business.
For the past two years my wife has been running a reasonably successful coffee and cake shop.

So in regards to country areas always lower wages than Bangkok. Chiang Mai can be quite low as well.

Country schools appreciate a teacher who always turns up for work(if your very very sick(two days off one term for me)or you can't get down because the river has flooded the main road), who can teach the students well and still create a lot of fun in the class room, who can develop a good rapport with the students, and who can show some flexibility.

**Thaitanium** · 14th May 2011 08:27

As per the merit part of the discussion...I think some people might need to clue in to the fact that their western thought process is of little value to them here.

Think of it this way...you are a native speaker...chances are none of your superiors will be native speakers...so who is it that you are going to impress with your product? The admin struggle to understand you...the parents struggle to understand you...the students struggle to understand you...so who is it that is going to recognize that you are doing a good job?

Imagine you are the director of an English school in America and you offer Thai programs...so you hire a Thai native speaker...but you don't speak,read or write Thai yourself...how will you, the students or the parents know if anyone is learning Thai properly. The students go home and say "salad and chaps" with a big smile and the parents get all proud at their little genius as he just said something in Thai. Who's to know?

You need to understand that your performance is not going to be graded the same way it would be back home...and if admin, parents and students can't know if the product is good then they have little choice than to grade you on some other criteria.

Try and guess what that might be...

**panhunger** · 14th May 2011 08:30

^^Newbies should read your post carefully.

---Update---

Originally Posted by Thaitanium

Imagine

Ah, Mr. Happy is back! ...still willing to take whatever they give you, eh? I'm pulling for you. Best of luck!

**Bangkok Phil** · 14th May 2011 08:42

At the moment there are at least 30-40 jobs on the ajarn jobs page that pay over 40,000 baht a month.

It might be worth mentioning that if you filter the jobs to those that pay 'at least 30K' some of those pay 35K up as well. We don't have an 'at least 35K a month' salary range but that will be changed in the next system overhaul.

---Update---

Can you guys take your arguing to PMs or something?

**Bangkok Phil** · 14th May 2011 08:47

Pan, Thaitanium, can you please take your arguments to PM or somewhere. Let's not derail the thread.

**Hollywood** · 14th May 2011 10:50

Thaitanium...I'll try to guess what that other criteria may be...

- Appearance
- How often you volunteer for gate duty
- How often you go to sports days
- How hard you make the students laugh while in class

Am I close?

**Thaitanium** · 14th May 2011 10:53

Yep...you're getting it...

Unfortunately...if you want to be a super teacher in most Thai schools it comes down to observing your Thai colleagues and copying them...Thankfully, I have no such aspirations...

Also keep in mind that Thailand is very much a paper culture in that due to wide spread incompetence and a general lack of attention ones documentation plays heavily in a Thai admins decision making process.

Having impressive documentation and experience gives the Admin a get out of jail free card if you turn out to be a nutter...He'll simply show your impressive list of credentials to any naysayers...and walk away unscathed.

The proper piece of paper in Thailand is as good as a recommendation from an existing employee of the institution in the west as both circumstances give the decision maker a place to shift the responsibility if things go wrong.

Less emphasis is attributed to your degree and experience from a performance or ability angle...remember this is a culture where saving face and covering ones ass is top priority.

**AGareth2** · 14th May 2011 11:30

Well I have been offered 37K but the job is in Thonburi, so things aren't all bad
However I'll probably take 350 an hour in Minburi and live at home with the family and work 4 days a week

**saknat** · 14th May 2011 13:16

Thanks for the Thank you Bangkok Phil and Panhunger

With the current school I asked NOT to see Sports Day, Christmas Day etc, go on teachers jaunts and go on English Camp Field Trips.

I did way too much of that with the previous school.. If you did not do those activities you would have been looked down upon.

Extra duties at the current school include an occasional in house English camp, participate in an occasional external local English contest and participate in local culture activities like the Loy Kratong Festival days.

I'm not an ass kisser by any means . It's just not me.

I've never done gate duty.

Cheers Saknat

**Mr. Hales** · 14th May 2011 13:37

Originally Posted by saknat

It's just not me.

maybe find a different gig then?

**Hollywood** · 14th May 2011 14:11

Saknat...I wouldn't call someone who does gate duty and participates in sport days an "ass kisser," which it seems as though you're implying. Correct me if I'm wrong, maybe I've misread what others have posted in the past, but isn't that sort of stuff expected from a teacher? What's ass kissing about doing what's expected?

**Thaitanium** · 14th May 2011 14:17

That's a tempest in a teapot that is...I guess the safest answer is to just state that one should do what one is comfortable with and leave it at that...anything more just enters into the realm of subjectivity and leads to all sorts of venomous opinionated drivel...

That said...we can now venture into the not so safe...

The problem typically arises when what's expected becomes too much...on one end of the spectrum you have a school, that if you allow it, they will expect you dto run the entire show on your own while they all go for 6 hour lunches...on the other end a school who treats you fairly and makes moderate requests.

Unfortunately many schools are opportunists and will spend the first month testing your definition of acceptable...they will continue to ask of you whatever you will agree to...

So one needs to have a clearly defined limit...but it's always going to be a balancing act.

I've had 2 schools state their appreciation at my voicing exactly what I will and will not do...don't be afraid to stand up for yourself...but do it with tact and sensitivity.